Need for a change in Team Greece

#1 by christosblack , Mon Dec 03, 2018 10:50 pm

Dear Sirs,

I am in the difficult position of writing this text in order to ask of you to give the possibility to Team Greece to come back into the ETC WH40K tournaments with a new captain.
Currently in Greece there is a strong WH40K community with many tournaments and a lot of interest for participation in international events. We have more than 50 active players in a variety of clubs and shops who have been asking why there has not been a Greek participation in the last few years in such an event.

After my participation in the recent WTC and the contacts I made in Greece afterwards, where all are of the same mind, we would be grateful if you could consider the proposal of the Greek WH40K community for our reappearance in the ETC with a new Captain

Regards,
Chris

christosblack  
christosblack
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Last edited 12.03.2018 | Top

RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#2 by TOM A , Mon Dec 03, 2018 11:28 pm

Hello Chris,

I contacted Yiannis, the current residing captain, about this issue. If he doesn't reply soon we can petition the chairmen officially to instate you or a new representative as the new Captain.

Will keep you in the loop!

TOM A  
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RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#3 by TOM A , Mon Dec 03, 2018 11:37 pm

Iannis posted this on the Captains section not too long ago. I contacted him a few minutes ago and he says this still stands:

Zitat
Greetings everyone,

It was impossible for many reasons for Team Greece to participate in the 2017 event, same and even more so was the state of affairs for last year as well, with all of the most competent and veteran players completely occupied, with activities that where simply impossible to put on hold. For the above reasons and with all the ETC and GW restructuring going on we did not intervene in any issue, but as I posted on contact details we are still here.

I wish to therefore inform everyone that the team is being reorganized and reassembled for the ETC 2019, we are even considering running for smaller ETC events and tournaments, good luck and a good season to everyone!



I would suggest to get in touch with the Greek ETC Team and see what terms of agreements you can come to in regards to representation for the ETC.

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RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#4 by christosblack , Tue Dec 04, 2018 11:10 pm

Hi again,

I would like to inform you that to the best of my knowledge there has been no effort whatsoever to gather a team from the members of official clubs and
shop/venue tournament goers in the last 2 years. Shop owners and club members have not been notified of any team call for an appearance in ETC or any other event.

As regards ourselves, we are in full cooperation with all major clubs in Greece and shop owners who are going to support us in our effort. As you already know a team appeared
in Zagreb and another one is coming to the Belgian Team Championships 2019. The first major team tournament in years is taking place by us this December, which has been added to tourneykeeper by the way, XMASS TEAM TOURNAMENT 2018 with ETC rulepack.

Unfortunately there has been an effort to contact the Captain recently by us and instead of an open and promising Greek participation to ETC our players were met with hostility.

Regards,
Chris

christosblack  
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RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#5 by TOM A , Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:27 pm

Quote: christosblack wrote in post #4
I would like to inform you that to the best of my knowledge there has been no effort whatsoever to gather a team from the members of official clubs and shop/venue tournament goers in the last 2 years. Shop owners and club members have not been notified of any team call for an appearance in ETC or any other event.

That's it. To the best of your knowledge is not conclusive enough.

Zitat
Unfortunately there has been an effort to contact the Captain recently by us and instead of an open and promising Greek participation to ETC our players were met with hostility.


This is exactly why the ETC is taking a stance in NOT interfering with politicking within a team on the national level. There is no way for our chairmen to know what is what, nor can they invest the time to look in greater detail what is going on. Your best bet is raising this point in your community and enforcing something to happen in that regard. Feel free to link to any pages where issues like this are being discussed within your community to any of the chairmen.

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RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#6 by Ianos , Wed Dec 05, 2018 11:03 pm

Everything is clear and available in the official Team Hellas FB page where you can see the charter as voted by the previous team members including some of the WTC participants. I also have proof of how the contacting happened, and if there where any (internet and mobile archives). The chairman TOM A had also no issue in finding me late at night when this thread came up, to resolve the issue asap, to which I responded immediately as always. As voted by the last playing team (as well) I am the captain unanimously, coach is still the coach unanimously and we expect you to follow the rules for once and contact us, just as the chairman has already told you to do. Your co-participators in the WTC as well as everyone in the community who has ever wanted to know us, even have our mobile phone numbers. I also expect you to inform me (as i have also asked, almost 2 months ago, the only person from your group AFAIK who contacted me then) on who those (you) people are who want to participate, who the clubs and the organizations are. Honestly, I don't understand why you are lying for things you supposedly don't know and what all this is about. Those who supposedly want to participate should contact the official team and not vice versa, in spite of me notifying everyone for years now, because of my own volition. You folks being unwilling to follow any charters, any simple rules or any guidance offered to you by the head chairman for 40k is proof enough that you are not team material. It is surprising though, that former team members of the official team that still exists, failed to inform you either. Contact me with names this time, I need to see the 50 names and the exact clubs etc. Furthermore since you (plural) have come to the point of bringing this matter to the forum, challenging the standing Captain, Coach and Team, you must now finally disclose the real name of the ACTUAL challenger, so that everyone can finally know who is behind this (regarding captaincy), and until you do I will have no further discussion about this. It is also obvious that you are talking about a pool of players and not a team. The coach and I are still and always available, as we have always been.


P.S.1 Tom, I am compiling all pertinent facts and archives to send to the chairmen in case you require them, so you can have a clear picture if you need to.
P.S.2 I feel sorry that the ETC community had to see what is going on in Greece in the worst possible way, especially with all the real challenges the ETC is facing currently.

Ianos  
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RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#7 by pizzaguardian , Thu Dec 06, 2018 10:09 am

Ianos, your lack of understanding the situation is clear.

Tom is not a chairmen, hasn't been a chairmen since at least for 2 years.

The current chairmen is considering the situation, you have failed to bring a team to the ETC for 2 years straight and consider the fact the last time there was a Greek 40K team the event was in Greece, which is not saying much.

We take this matter seriously. And consider the facts as presented, it is rare that the Chair act on such matters but when a team fails to show up for 2 years we will look into the situation.

Feel free to make your case here if you wish, but also know that the request is being taken seriously.

Işık - pizzaguardian


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RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#8 by Ianos , Sat Dec 08, 2018 3:03 am

Dear Mr. Chairman pizzaguardian,

I am obliged to inform you that I am fully aware, for a while now, that TOM A is a former Chairman (his absence of signature is quite easy to spot anyhow); I only referred to him in that way in an honorary manner and out of respect, as it is customary for prominent individuals to be referred to with their latest most important title.

As such I sincerely hope, that wording, which could even be attributed to a typo, is not to be considered to make me look like less of a captain, in either your or the rest of the chairmen’s eyes.

I and the coach will be convening with the rest of the team in the coming days and I will post again on this thread hopefully within the next week.

Meanwhile Mr. christoblack and the individuals he claims to represent, will have even more ample time to make proper contact with me (besides Mr. christosblack has all my contact details), as I am always ready to include ever-more people into team formation, disregarding any past actual or perceived grievances or misunderstandings.

Best regards to everyone.

Ianos  
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Last edited 12.08.2018 | Top

RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#9 by HyperionA , Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:04 am

Well fast forward to 2019 and Greek ETC team is more dead than ever. The new captain is supposed to be this person (Real Name: Konstantinos Binios Nickname on the Forum: Arhra -E-mail: revan313@hotmail.com -Country: Greece)? How this person came to be? He ain't replying to emails that's for sure so how can we find him? Has Yiannis Adamopoulos stepped down and passed the Captainhood to him? I understand that no one wants to intervene in each country's internal affairs regarding the team but for sure a procedure should come up so that a captain can be elected if the community backs him up.

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RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#10 by TOM A , Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:53 pm

Provide proof that the entire Greek community is behind the captain change and we can have a basis for action. Until then this is bickering and internal community business that cannot be acted upon.

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RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#11 by TOM A , Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:56 pm

Quote: HyperionA wrote in post #9
I understand that no one wants to intervene in each country's internal affairs regarding the team but for sure a procedure should come up so that a captain can be elected if the community backs him up.

Your community should set up these procedures. The ETC boars cannot have executive power over people and communities it has no involvement with. Far from the bed show. Most countries have a facebook page with transparent procedures for captain and team selection. Maybe time to start one for the Greek team?

TOM A  
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RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#12 by Arhra , Fri Jan 11, 2019 9:59 pm

The e-mail you are reffering to was sent yesterday morning and I replied today morning.If that is an unreasonable time for a responce, please let me know. Edit* Time and date are visible.|addpics|nin-1-f079.png,nin-2-bed2.png|/addpics|

 
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RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#13 by Arhra , Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:24 pm

TOM A we have these procedures but since there were some matters pending at the captain's council I did not want to make any announcements yet.

 
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RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#14 by christosblack , Mon Jan 14, 2019 9:10 pm

Dear Sirs,

I have to reiterate the need for a change in the Captaincy of Team Greece as the only one which will give the opportunity for the Greek community as I have already mentioned in my previous email to properly participate in the ETC events which are highly valued by us.

I have already sent proof to the chairmen that the Greek community is behind this move. And when I refer to the Greek community I refer to both players and shops. The players, of which we have only mentioned a fraction, are the ones who participate in tournaments both in Greece and abroad.
There are many members of the Greek 40K ETC Team and constitute the backbone of the Greek future teams. All of them belong to official Clubs and unofficial groups with a proven existence which have organised leagues in the past few years as well as team and singles tournaments.

These people have sacrificed a lot of their time to bring the level of competitiveness up a notch or two. It would be unfair to disregard all these and not take into account that there was a challenge towards the ex (?)captain before he passed (?) the captaincy to someone else. The FB page of the Greek 40K team has been silent for years and no call has been made for a team. Players who wanted to participate in this great Team event were not able because no team was to be formed. There are procedures in the Greek FB page for the Captaincy, but they were not followed.

Gentlemen and (Ladies) this challenge has nothing to do with internal bickering. The crux of the matter is this: Do you want the ETC to grow even more? Do you want your child to thrive on the respect that it will gain if you support live communities and the respect that these communities will show towards an event which promotes competitiveness and sportsmanship? We would like to help towards such a goal. Because this is what the ETC should stand for.

Please, ask for the info we have given to the chair and check it out. We have nothing to hide.

Regards,
ChristosBlack

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RE: Need for a change in Team Greece

#15 by cegorach , Tue Jan 15, 2019 1:07 pm

As someone who have participated in the greek team for 4 years, having sacrificed both time and money, especially in the difficult years of the economic crisis, i must add my 2 cents.

I didn't want to get involved, but this thread is an embarashment for my country. It is in the nature of greeks it seems to fight eachother instead of uniting.
I know the new captain personaly and i know that he has no grudges with anyone and how can he, when he doesn't know some people personaly yet?
Day after day you "attack" him, when you have not even tried to make contact with him. You present some clubs and people that stand before a change, yet personaly i know some people in your list that don't even know they are included in that list.

I can agree, a change was needed, and it has happened. The new captain is an active player with ties to a lot of clubs as well and i am sure he would want to have an even greater pool of people to choose from. Nobody has excluded anyone from the team and if we wouldn't waste our time here "fighting", we would use that time to organise better the team and the events. As i said, i know him personaly and i know that he is trying to make a plan for the captain's calls as we speak, trying to make them work best for all the players of the country, not just those in Athens. Isn't a larger pool of people to choose from what we all want and what you support?

Instead of disgracing us further to the community, i suggest that those who are interested contact the new captain, see his views and plan and i am sure everything will work for the best.

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