Discussion about the New Charter

#1 by pizzaguardian , Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:06 pm

Posting this early, since even if i dont become a chairmen this imo is somthing that must be considered.

This topic is intended as a general dialogue topic about if we need a new charter or not. And what should that charter include if changes are made.

Here is the bare minimum version i prepped. This is not a draft or anything, just me taking a look at the charter and updating it with minimal interfrence.

Zitat
The European Team Championship Charter
Updated 2018.**.**

The purpose of this document is to outline the fundamental rules, goals and ambitions for the European Team Championship (ETC).
Each attendee to the event is expected to be aware of its content and abide by it.

ETC Spirit
1. The ETC is an event created for the players, by the players. The most important goal for the ETC is to hold a yearly event where players from all over the world meet up and have fun. Like most tournaments it also provides the framework for meeting up and socializing.
2. Gaming works best in cooperation with some food, drinks and having fun. Every attendee is expected to behave like a gentleman, respect and share the fun with the other attendees. This applies in and off games and includes giving a hand to keep things tidy and clean on site.
3. The ETC is an event for the players of Flames of War, The 9th Age and Warhammer 40,000. All 3 systems have different rules packs but share this charter amongst other things (the venue, combined awards, silly t-shirts …).
4. The ETC aims to be the most prestigious team tournament there is by drawing the most skilled players from any country that has a gaming community.
5. How “the most skilled players” is interpreted exactly is left open for each country’s community to decide. The ETC is an event, not a federation and as such has no vocation in influencing each community’s approach to the hobby.
6. Official ETC language is English. Attendees are expected to express themselves in that language when games are on. If problems occur with team mates talking together during a game in a language that cannot be understood, this problem can be brought before a referee.

ETC Awards
7. The ETC prizes will always be symbolic, such as a diploma and/or a medal. No cash prizes, box sets or anything ordinarily valuable.
8. There are three ETC rankings: Generalship, Fairplay and Best Painted. Generalship rankings are addressed by each game system in their rules pack. Each team will vote for three other teams at the end of the tournament to provide Fairplay and Best Painted rankings in each game system.

ETC organization
9. The event is run on a voluntary basis, no one involved gets paid for the time they put into it. Though the staff involved isn’t paid, they shouldn’t suffer any further expenses because of their involvement. The ETC should strive to refurbish all staff expenses and at the same time lowering the participation fees through sponsorships and alternative financing.
10. The ETC organization relies on the involvement of several types of people:
• “Captains” do most of the deciding in the ETC preparation through their voting in the Captains Councils, see below for more and especially “Teams & Representing a country” on the captain’s role.
• “Host Organizer” is heading the team who does the actual organizing on the spot for a given edition, see “Hosting the ETC” below.
• “Referees” are the almighty gods ruling each game systems during the tournaments, see “ETC Discipline” below.
• “Computer Geniuses” are the guys who help us reaching over so many countries during the preparation, maintain our memory of the events through the ETC website and report “live” from the events, and also help the referees register the round results and compute the rankings/pairings. Computer Geniuses report to the Head Computer Genius and to the Combined Captains Council for anything online; they report to the Captain Councils, Referees and Host Organizers for anything concerning an edition’s organization.
• “Moderators” police debates in both game systems' ETC forum sections, share past experiences, mobilize people on topics structuring each side of the event in their game system. Moderators are often the ETC Chairmen (see below), but the Chairmen can also nominate additional moderators.
• “ETC Chairmen” moderate the Combined Captain Council and are in touch with the organizers to make sure the event gets better every year. Chairmen are elected each year in September by the Captains Council, anyone can stand for election but only one Chairman can be elected from each country. If two people from the same country would have been elected, the 7th person on the list is elected, etc. Up to six Chairmen are to be elected in total this way.
•The Chairmen act as the “board” of the ETC and make all the day to day decisions that are not covered by this Charter. It is advised that the Chairmen put forth a poll to the Captains Council on all substantial decisions. If the ETC Chairmen can not reach a compromise then a poll is not just advised but mandatory. The Chairmen are required to have full confidentiality with regards to their internal debates.
• Five Captains can petition any of the six elected Chairmen, or the entire Board, for a 'vote of no confidence' at any time and if such a poll gets a 2/3 majority the Chairman/Board is immediately removed and a new Chairman/Board must be elected within a month. The Chairman contacted is required full confidentiality in setting up the vote.
For practical reasons, anyone assuming one or several roles described above will mention it in their forum profile’s signature as explicitly as possible.

11. The ETC organization is ruled by 4 deciding bodies:
• The 9th Age Captains Council, regrouping the T9A Team Captains to decide on ETC T9A-only issues.
• the 40K Captains Council, regrouping the 40K Team Captains to decide on ETC 40K-only issues.
• the FoW Captains Council, regrouping the FOW Team Captains to decide on FoW-only issues.
• the Combined Captains council, regrouping the FoW, 40K&T9A Team Captains to decide on non game-specific and overall organization issues .
FoW, T9A&40K Captains Councils each have their own rules for voting and deciding matters.

12. Polls & Deciding matters at the Combined Captains Council.
• Polls are formulated by Chairmen only. In extraordinary circumstances a Captain can formulate a poll which will proceed if backed up by 10 other Captains.
• Each poll will offer one or several yes/no alternatives or clearly identified options, and mention an end date which will always be two weeks after it was posted, ending at midnight GMT. A vote will never end on a Friday/Saturday/Sunday. The Chairmen will announce important polls (like choosing a years venue) to the captains' emails.
• Each team has one vote, which is cast by the teams elected Captain (or another person designated by the team's Captain). Team Captains are only given a vote if their team has participated in at least one of the two most recent ETC editions. Note that everyone is welcome to provide input regardless of whether or not they have a vote or are members of a team.
• Decisions are voted by a simple majority of the voters. Changing this charter will always require a 2/3 majority. Changes to the Charter must step into force at at least one month after the vote. Only determined votes count toward the results (one cannot vote for exclusive choices at the same time).

Teams & Representing a country
14. Any country can send one team to represent them. FIFA guidelines are followed for a definition of what a country is, though other sovereign nations who are not recognised by FIFA (eg Monaco) are also allowed to attend. Only one team from each country is allowed entrance in each gaming system (FoW, T9A and 40K). How to select a team is left for the individual country to decide and is not something the ETC rules or organization will influence or participate in. In the case of a country sending two teams, then the latest Captain of that country (ie the player who captained that country’s team most recently at the ETC) decides which team is accepted. If there are any grievances over this, a complaint can be sent to the Chairmen in full confidentiality.

In order to participate at the ETC, at least half the team must be citizens of the country they represent. In the vast majority of cases, citizenship is determined by a player’s nationality as shown on their passport. In rare cases (eg players with dual citizenship, or those whose countries don't have their own passports), a player may be eligible to represent more than one country. These players can play for any country they are a citizen of, providing they meet at least one of the following requirements:
a) They, or one or more of their biological parents or grandparents were born in that country.
b) They have resided in that country for a period of at least 2 years after the age of 18.
Teams may be asked to provide proof of nationality for their players, before or during the event. The Chairman may impose sanctions on teams who attend the ETC without meeting the nationality requirements.

The Chairmen may grant a temporary exemption to the nationality requirements to teams who suffer last minute dropouts, but this will not give such a team voting rights in ETC matters.

14. Each team elects a team Captain. That person is the official contact person for the team. They cast votes in the name of their team and are expected to actively represent their team at the captains councils debates and votes. They are in charge to solve problems during the games if things go wrong. They are "responsible" for the team members and the "spirit" of the team. They collect the team entry fees for the organizers and often organize travel arrangements for the team. Captains are also asked to share how their teams are formed and what feedback and stories they have from their attendance in order to maintain collective memory and share the fun.

Hosting the ETC
15. In a two month period, beginning each year right after the ETC has ended, anyone willing can propose to hold the ETC two years in the future. Not the next ETC, but the one following that one. At the end of the four month period (usually in January), there is a vote for the location if there are several that have put forth a bid.
16. Dates for hosting the ETC will be confirmed on a yearly basis by the Combined Captains Council. Historically, the tournament is held on the first or second week of August.
17. Once the bids for hosting the ETC are voted for, the winning bid is designated “host organizer” who is responsible for the organization of the whole event and is the primary contact point to the organization team for the captain councils. In case of a draw the Chairmen cast one vote each as a tiebreaker, Chairmen whose country's bid is considered in this tiebreaker are not allowed to vote.
19. The host organizer is elected to host the ETC for both FoW, 40K & T9A team tournaments and side/single events and is expected to treat all those events as equally important. He will seek approval of his actions by the captain councils and apply their decisions.
20. The host organizer will endeavor to provide as many Referees as possible and will nominate one Head Referee for each gaming system. See "ETC Discipline" below.
21. The host organizer can designate other persons to deal with particular fields of the organization, for instance a T9A host organizer, a 40K host organizer, a transportation host organizer, lodging host organizer, logistics host organizer, computer host organizer…

ETC Discipline
22. The ETC will establish a pool of international referees for each game system to act as judges at the tournament. The size and nature of the event requires availability of a lot of referees, coordinated by head referees.
23. At each event there should be three Head Referees present per game system: One is nominated by the host organizer, two are nominated by the Chairmen. No two Head Referees can be from the same country and all Head Referees have to be approved by the ETC Chairmen.
• All Head Referees have the same rank and will get their basic travel costs refunded. The Head Referees nominate one of their numbers as Chief Referee who has the final say in all rules matters.
• The hosting nation should endeavor to supply as many Common Referees as possible. The ETC administration will endeavor to refund travel costs, primarily for the international Common Referees.
24. Given the international nature of the referee corp, it is expected that referees from a particular country will not judge the tables where their countrymen play.
25. The referees have a mandate to give any team penalty points if they deem it necessary to penalize players for instance for cheating of some sort or intentional stalling.
26. Penalty points are decreased from the guilty team game points total and affect the team result for the round, but do not affect the opposing team result in the round. Penalties never breed good things in our hobby and we trust the attendees to avoid them at all cost.



Please post any ideas and opinions you have below.

It doesnt need to be specific points, even general directional suggestions about the ETC are welcome.


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Last edited 09.23.2018 | Top

RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#2 by arthain , Mon Sep 24, 2018 10:49 am

Hi

A bold/red highlight on the changes done would be much appreciated.

Thanks for the time taken for this. I know from personal experience it is a gruesome task.

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RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#3 by pizzaguardian , Mon Sep 24, 2018 4:43 pm

There is really not much of a change on this one except for,

References changed from WHF to ETC forum,

WHF admin removed from position of perma chair.


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RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#4 by Skcuzz , Mon Sep 24, 2018 5:10 pm

Re: referees... (surprise, surprise, this is what I bring up)

Personally I would like to remove about 1 head referee being provided by the host nation. Whilst not wishing to insult anyone, and speaking from my experience in 40k, more often than not the host nation is unable able to provide a referee of the required calibre to function as a head referee. As such it often becomes a lame duck roll.

Instead of this, why not treat the 3 head referees like we treat the chairmen. People can nominate themselves for the position and they are then voted in by the respective system captains? The. After that if there are any other referees required, it is the head referees who select them, in cooperation with the chairmen regarding numbers and logistics.

End of the day the players and captains know who they want to be in charge on the weekend.

As a further to this point I would also suggest that for the duration of the ETC itself the head referees authority is absolute. That neither captains nor chairmen can challenge a decision made by the head referees, without first a majority vote of said captains and chairmen. This way the authourity of the head referees is made absolute as will therefore the respect for the position. Lastly that if there is a conflict of interest within the Head Referees; then the head referees from the other systems be brought in to arbitrate.

Thoughts?

(Sorry for any mistakes - writing this on my phone on a train)

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RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#5 by Mike (Santa) Klaka , Mon Sep 24, 2018 6:31 pm

Sorry


Team England FOW Coach (non playing)

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Last edited 09.24.2018 | Top

RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#6 by Mike (Santa) Klaka , Mon Sep 24, 2018 6:46 pm

A very small point, 11. would be better worded if it talked of 'The Major Rule Systems' or something similar rather than 40K, 9th Age & FOW specifically if these change at any time in the future it will not need rewording. I realise that in order to change the 'Major Rule Systems' there needs to be a change to the Charter but it is easy to overlook such details if you word the thing as it is presently worded. Look at how the list of teams denied voting rights has not been altered as an example. If the rules are worded to be in general and any lists are just a specific side issue you will find it much easier to react to minor changes (for example a rule system changing its name). This theme appears in several different parts of the charter at present, e.g.Referees

Mike


Team England FOW Coach (non playing)

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RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#7 by pizzaguardian , Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:03 pm

One of the most important things about the charter is who it gives voting rights to. It is specific like that for a reason. A "Major System" doesn't just have voting rights, their game also must be hosted by the organiser. So keeping it specific to the game systems i think is a fine solution.


Not saying any of the above can't be changed, just expalining why it was written specifically like that.

With the proposed charter i would also suggest making X-Wing a Main-Mandatory System too. But every addition should require the approval of those already in.


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RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#8 by Brestfloda , Tue Sep 25, 2018 7:03 am

Completely agree with Neil, we need the referees to be equipped with absolute power.

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RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#9 by Chris Legg , Tue Sep 25, 2018 9:50 am

I would envisage that the new chair board completely rewrites the majority of the wording to better reflect how it runs at this time - not just making cosmetic changes.


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RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#10 by TOM A , Tue Sep 25, 2018 7:20 pm

Quote: Skcuzz wrote in post #4

Personally I would like to remove about 1 head referee being provided by the host nation. Whilst not wishing to insult anyone, and speaking from my experience in 40k, more often than not the host nation is unable able to provide a referee of the required calibre to function as a head referee. As such it often becomes a lame duck roll.

40K has the luxury of having a lot of able and willing referees. Not all systems are so lucky. The simple rule of having the org provide at least one head ref has been historically put in place back in the day so the host org will at least always have one head ref for each system they are running at their event. It is their responsibility to ensure that the events they have in place are covered.

With the system you propose you put this in the hands of the community and it becomes a lot more complex. For each system we have to track and monitor volunteers, somehow make sure they find their way to the forums in the first place (which historically, almost none of the refs have done), and need someone to oversee all this, run the polls,… It tacks on a lot of work for what I imagine is the ETC board (who for the last few years have also run on the motivation and willingness of a singular chairmen) and needs contingencies. Again we are lucky as we currently have an able and willing chairmen to chase all this for us but again, not all systems are that lucky… What if we don’t have 3 head refs for each system? Do we then default to the orga needing to provide one? Or even more to cover the needs? Imo it is way better for the host org to have the need to provide a head referee. He can still be demoted to lineref if there are more than enough able and willing referees but at least this way it covers the basic need for a head ref to be in place to help run the event hosted by the org.

Zitat
Instead of this, why not treat the 3 head referees like we treat the chairmen. People can nominate themselves for the position and they are then voted in by the respective system captains? The. After that if there are any other referees required, it is the head referees who select them, in cooperation with the chairmen regarding numbers and logistics.


Groups within groups within groups. It is a nice idea, and it can for sure work, but I don't see it work for every system or from year on year as someone needs to take the lead on this. Experience tells me this is better to have as a requirement from the orga side as it is their business to run a decent event and put in place the necessary tools and referees to ensure the event runs smooth. I would not take that responsibility away from the orga side.

Zitat
As a further to this point I would also suggest that for the duration of the ETC itself the head referees authority is absolute. That neither captains nor chairmen can challenge a decision made by the head referees, without first a majority vote of said captains and chairmen. This way the authourity of the head referees is made absolute as will therefore the respect for the position. Lastly that if there is a conflict of interest within the Head Referees; then the head referees from the other systems be brought in to arbitrate.


I firmly stand behind this.

It would help though, if the referees took their authority a bit more serious as well and gave a debrief after every event. I have asked for a 40K debrief numerous times as you well know, as well as for a list of potential adds to the FAQ. If you want to be given ownership as a referee I feel that as a group, you should act like owners as well. I am seeing little to none of it though outside of performing well at the event itself. It would help if the referees were more involved in the entire process rather than the weeks leading up to the event and just the days of the event itself.

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Last edited 09.25.2018 | Top

RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#11 by TOM A , Tue Sep 25, 2018 7:56 pm

For me, there are a few things we need to address and discuss in detail before we proceed with a new charter:

1. Voting rights
I think the 'need to have attended at least one etc the last two years rule' is a bit outdated. Newly joined captains should get a vote at the table imo. We have grown so much in size that 'new' captains cannot possibly hold swing votes, which is what was the prime reason for enforcing this rule in the first place. I suggest we open up voting rights to every current captain (regardless if they have played in an etc in the last few years or not, i would just discard that rule altogether. if someone is so involved with the etc they will comment and vote despite not playing at the etc then they should be allowed a seat at the table imo) and every new captain also gets a seat at the table for shaping the event they want to play in.

2. The ETC brand
It was voted in in 2014 but it seems some chairmen and orga's seem unwilling to use it or acknowledge the ETC brand that was pushed through by the chairmen in 2013-2014 to get the ETC a visual representation and a more professional look. I would like the captains to officially endorse this once again and have it included in the charter so we can have a uniform and more professional approach towards the outside world. If we want to be taken more seriously by our partners this is a necessity imo.

The original file:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/71jxrdsw2qs5ta...oposal.pdf?dl=0

3. Referees
This is an indispensable part of the ETC, and I would like to see things put in place for these volunteers to refund their involvement. We have evolved so much with this over the years and we have grown so much in size that the budget of 3000 euros for this is laughable. The referees need to be compensated for their efforts, get more authority and say, but also need to be more responsible and professional in their involvement with the ETC both before and after the event. If we want to promote the gentlemens game and weed out the bad apples we need debriefing and we need accountability from year to year on who got carded for which offenses. I think it is high time to put all that down on paper. Not to publicly shame people but to be able to see on paper what recurring offenders and offenses we have and to take appropriate, fact-based actions.

4. Profit at ETC events
Year by year the ETC orgs have been running profits. The ETC in 2014 was the only one in my recollection that openly stated they had so before the captains council. Profits in Gorzow were so big the ETC org at the time could afford a bradn new BMW off of the backs of the ETC community.. I think we need to start thinking about having some of that money flow back to the ETC as an entity. Year by year the event grows more difficult to organise as it grows in size, but the ETC as an entity has nothing to show for itself. We don't own mats or terrains, and it is a hassle dealing with requirements of the ETC in terms of scaleability year on year. I think we need to be OK with having people run a profit so they no longer feel they have to resort to sneaky ways to hide profits or to not post accountability after the event, so we can all have a more transparent view on what goes in and out, and can work towards ways with which we can have some of the money flow back to the ETC so it can own terrains, invest in mats, pay for the storage and shipping it to future orga's every year, own a proper website and webshop, ...
I have looked into creating an international non profit org that can be completely tuned into the current ways of working. You would have 2 people that created the inpo (international non profit org), the chairmen board that is elected each year holds the organisational reigns and the captains council can be written in as the ruling body. Downside is that it costs about 2000 euros to create here in Belgium, and that there are a lot of differences in regards to labor laws and whatnot compared to neighbouring countries. I don't mind taking the lead on this and do all the necessary work on the statutes and whatnot (after feedback to the CCC of course), but we would need a budget. Maybe a crowdfunding campaign could help here? If every ETC player chimes in with 2 euro this can become a reality very soon and easily.

5. Chairmen roles
I think we need to redefine the chairmen roles. When I started way back in the day as a chairmen when Jedi was still around (Jedi was the one who started this entire ETC thing btw and was a major influence into shaping it into what it has become now), the prime reason for chairmen to exist was to be the middleman. Every idea was tossed back to the captains, reshaped, remoulded and rehashed with their input into something that the entire community, or large part of it, could stand behind. The last few years though we have a group of chairmen who not only have a slew of inactive members within their ranks, but also chairmen who think that taking 'day to day decisions not lined out in the charter' means they have free reign to push through their agendas without polling the captains whatso-ever. This is becoming more and more of a theme so I would like to see chairmen roles redefined, with the clear statement that not a singular vote can be started without first polling the captains with a voting outline so feedback and comments can be given prior to starting the vote. Especially when the chairmen already know upfront that the vote in question is going to be challenged.

I would also like to think of a way to track and monitor chairmen inactivity. Now we have the situation where we have 7 chairmen of whom only 3-4 regularly give their input in matters and of whom only one really does any of the required work to get to a better ETC. I think chairmen should not protect their peers who signed up for a job they are not doing, and that there needs to be opportunity for chairmen to be replaced along the road if they don't put in the time or can't find the time anymore to improve the event overall. I think every chairmen should state a few clear goals and achievements that they can be held accountable for.

One of them could be for instance:
I will personally make sure everyone gets decent trophies this year and then work towards getting everyone a piece of paper at the etc if they achieve podium. That just requires you to get in touch with someone throughout the year to make a good design, make sure the prints are available come the ETC for every system, and so on and soforth. It can be something very easy but achieveble that adds to everyone's enjoyment of the event. There are a million-and one things chairmen could do to add to the event but alas the last few years we have very little initiatives taken to improve on the subtle aspects that make an overall better experience for everyone. I think that should be the prime focus of the chairmen, and I think every chairmen has their little pet peeve aspect where they can help to improve things.

Those are just a few of the things on my list for all of you to mull over already. Have at it.

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RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#12 by El Rey , Tue Sep 25, 2018 10:07 pm

Quote: TOM A wrote in post #11

1. Voting rights
I think the 'need to have attended at least one etc the last two years rule' is a bit outdated. Newly joined captains should get a vote at the table imo. We have grown so much in size that 'new' captains cannot possibly hold swing votes, which is what was the prime reason for enforcing this rule in the first place. I suggest we open up voting rights to every current captain (regardless if they have played in an etc in the last few years or not, i would just discard that rule altogether. if someone is so involved with the etc they will comment and vote despite not playing at the etc then they should be allowed a seat at the table imo) and every new captain also gets a seat at the table for shaping the event they want to play in.


I do not agree here for 2 main reason. First if a team have not been to the ETC and experienced it, I do not think they are qualified enough to make decisions about something they might know how works in reality. Second, how could in theory make new teams and get votes, but never show up to the ETC. Like a team Greenland, voting like team Denmark etc. Also we would need some rules anyway for when a team vote have a valid vote. Is it when 1 persons says he is the captain for some country or at what point? I think the rule is fair as it is now and easy enough to administrate. No need to fix that in the charter, as it is not broken.


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RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#13 by Potan , Thu Sep 27, 2018 5:40 pm

Zitat
the ETC so it can own terrains, invest in mats, pay for the storage and shipping it to future orga's every year, own a proper website and webshop, ...



But where to store them? I mean both country and warehouse wise.

This is crucial, because I see no "cheap & easy" way of transporting them when ETC its one year in Athens then in Salamanca, then Zagreb. All across whole Europe.

And who would organise these transports? "Etc" (which would be who?) or host orga? And it would also cost greatly.

And storing so many terrains, mats and tables would cost from my experience about more then two thousands euros per month even in Czechia. And I think were fairly costing country.

And what would be selling from ETC webshop? And who will run it, mantein it, etc?


2018 ETC - Czech Republic W40K Co-Captain

 
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RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#14 by TOM A , Thu Sep 27, 2018 6:28 pm

Quote: Potan wrote in post #13
But where to store them? I mean both country and warehouse wise.

Again, the community can help with this. I have an attic where this can be done if need be, maybe gamemat.eu is willing to offer up space for this in their warehouses,... we can find a solution I think if we address the problem.

Zitat
This is crucial, because I see no "cheap & easy" way of transporting them when ETC its one year in Athens then in Salamanca, then Zagreb. All across whole Europe.


It is logistics. For this ETC we are driving someone to Germany probably to pick up their mats and terrains for T9A or have it shipped over for a few hundreds of euros. If this would need to be budgeted extra, each player would have to pay 1-5 euros extra on their entrance fee. Not a big deal for playing on great tables with mats? It's an extra incurred cost maybe, but it CAN be budgeted for.

Zitat
And who would organise these transports? "Etc" (which would be who?) or host orga? And it would also cost greatly.


Chairmen, an etc non profit org board, a trusted captain, a partner or sponsor, ... We can find a solution if we address the problem.

Zitat
And storing so many terrains, mats and tables would cost from my experience about more then two thousands euros per month even in Czechia. And I think were fairly costing country.


A garage storage here in Belgium is 50€ per month, and my house is free. I guess we ain't doing it in Czech Republic then ;)

Zitat
And what would be selling from ETC webshop? And who will run it, mantein it, etc?


Tickets for the event? Swag?
As to who will run it, same as above for the transport.

Point I am trying to make is this:
The ETC has between 20-60k euros turnaround each year. Orgas make profit of the event (in Gorzow alledgedly more than 20.000 euros was pocketed by the organiser). Wouldn't it be great if we could use some of that profit (it can easily be done) for all things you mention as a problem above? What if we say: its ok to run profit but 20% flows back to the ETC? In gorzow that means 4000 euros would have been syphoned back to the ETC, in Serbia 2014 it would have been 1200 euros. I think storage and shipping and stuff can be budgeted with that kind of money, or a percentage of ticket sales can go to the ETC org rather than the host org if it is run through a webshop, ... The options are legio here. I am just saying with this charter reform it is time to think about restructuring the ETC in such a way that hosting the ETC is feasible on the long term. Right now the ETC is turning on the goodwill of the organisers and the community. As the event keeps on growing this is untenable. Organising the ETC has become considerably harder over the years, especially as expectations rise with it.

So let's all have a think about how we can best do this restructuring, and make organising the event a little easier for future orgs by knowing there is an organisation behind the etc that has the orga's backs...

Again, I don't mind taking the lead on this, and even if captains shoot the idea down now, I will start something of my own and use whatever means at my disposal to get what was acquired for the ETC (like the mantic terrain that was donated for the ETC) available for each future org, to have an inventory status, and to get the ball rolling.

TOM A  
TOM A
Posts: 142
Date registered 05.16.2018

Last edited 09.27.2018 | Top

RE: Discussion about the New Charter

#15 by Potan , Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:25 am

Zitat
A garage storage here in Belgium is 50€ per month, and my house is free.



Well, you would fill garage full of stuff (terrains, folding tables and mats,etc) for tournamets with just 30 tables. Been there, seen that. :)

ETC need how much? 500? Thats a lot of garages :)

But jokes aside, I got your point.

But having own etc terrain brings a lot of complications - ETC first needs own budget and some stored money. Because storing stuff in twenty garages across Europe is not a solution. And if renting a storagehouse, its imho necesary to have some spare money for case if "ETC year XY" would be non profitable - which could always happen out of pure misfortune or because host orga wants new BMW.

I think ETC first of need to have its account/money for some time - which brings another problem who will take care of it and other "law stuff" - and than it could think about having terrains and stuff.

But all its long run problem and need bigger restructualizations and imho its not things, that could be just added to the charter.


2018 ETC - Czech Republic W40K Co-Captain

 
Potan
Posts: 14
Date registered 08.17.2018


   

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