RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#16 by Doktor Helge , Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:56 pm

I absolutely agree regarding sneaking up
Your attacking platoon is deployed more than 4 away from the tank.
The first inf team to nov moves MORE than 4 to get into contact.
The fact that secondary teams Can swarm up behind the first team and thereby move less than 4 to get in contact with The team in front, should not give Them sneaking up on tanks... in reality the move together with the other inf team attacking together, the do not throw their bayonettes and grenades across their freind to hit the tank..


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RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#17 by graham , Mon Jul 02, 2018 6:49 am

Thanks for the replies. I'll gather more until Thursday. Then I'll revise the document (I think I can see one change already ) and ask Jonny to call a vote.

Keep the comments coming!


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RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#18 by graham , Tue Jul 03, 2018 7:00 pm

Just realised that I'll need to adjust the wording on warrior independent teams to clarify that it does not overrule de Gaulle's special rule. (He needs to be on table early to do his magic.)


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RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#19 by Doktor Helge , Wed Jul 04, 2018 2:19 am

I absolutely agree with ReBrock
I is a gross missuse Of the rulebook if you allow sneaking up on tanks with an ambushing unit


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RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#20 by graham , Wed Jul 04, 2018 7:28 am

Yep, got the message on Sunday. I will change the proposal. A big thank you to Mongol and his team for flagging it here rather than letting it happen on the table.


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Last edited 07.04.2018 | Top

RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#21 by Tarzit , Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:42 am

We have answer from Phil about sneak attack

https://m.facebook.com/groups/1045279105...992101904197847


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RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#22 by graham , Wed Jul 04, 2018 2:47 pm

Guys, enough on the ambush/sneaking already. It is clear that there is a majority in favour of banning it. Phil has acknowledged on FB that it is legal RAW but that it is not what he intended (thanks for posting that, Tarzit). As I have said twice already, I will revise the proposal.

I'll update the document on Friday - currently the only changes that I plan to make are on ambush/sneaking and on de Gaulle. Then I'll ask Jonny to call a vote.


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RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#23 by Jonny , Thu Jul 05, 2018 1:35 am

Quote: graham wrote in post #22
Guys, enough on the ambush/sneaking already. It is clear that there is a majority in favour of banning it. Phil has acknowledged on FB that it is legal RAW but that it is not what he intended (thanks for posting that, Tarzit). As I have said twice already, I will revise the proposal.

I'll update the document on Friday - currently the only changes that I plan to make are on ambush/sneaking and on de Gaulle. Then I'll ask Jonny to call a vote.

I agree. Keep in mind that the leapfrog sneak isn't just an ambush thing, it could happen in normal play too. If it was allowed, it would mean that infantry could sneak up on tanks from about 6" away (with sideways base on the bridging team), which seems really wrong.


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RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#24 by Mongol , Thu Jul 05, 2018 12:41 pm

Quote: graham wrote in post #20
Yep, got the message on Sunday. I will change the proposal. A big thank you to Mongol and his team for flagging it here rather than letting it happen on the table.

You're most welcome, we just did't want to encounter that in game.
That's the only reason we posted that.


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RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#25 by Lynx , Thu Jul 05, 2018 3:07 pm

Hey Graham,

Short question will we use the last lftf as ref for etc? If not how will we handel guns in DF in assaults?

Second thing is what i have seen about guns in assault. Could you clarify that point i'm affeaid i haven't undrestood it correctly.

Page 65 under heavy weapon it is written that these team are only assaulting teams if contacted. So basically they are should be treated as not beeing part of the assault no? Or at least be forced to break of if they aren't in contact.

Cheers


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RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#26 by graham , Thu Jul 05, 2018 6:53 pm

Quote: Lynx wrote in post #25
Hey Graham,

Short question will we use the last lftf as ref for etc? If not how will we handel guns in DF in assaults?


Yes, we will use them. The rulespack (page 2) says that we ignore LFTF published after 30 June. Happily the last update was mid-June so we use it.

Zitat
Second thing is what i have seen about guns in assault. Could you clarify that point i'm affeaid i haven't undrestood it correctly.

Page 65 under heavy weapon it is written that these team are only assaulting teams if contacted. So basically they are should be treated as not beeing part of the assault no? Or at least be forced to break of if they aren't in contact.

Cheers


You are right about the heavy weapons but that does not solve the issue because the relevant rules are not based on whether a team is an assaulting team. I have re-drafted the text in the document to spell out the relevant rules a bit more clearly. I hope it is clearer now.

I shall post it later once I have revised the document to address the sneaking up on tanks and the de Gaulle points.


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RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#27 by graham , Thu Jul 05, 2018 7:11 pm

[quote="Jonny"|p804I agree. Keep in mind that the leapfrog sneak isn't just an ambush thing, it could happen in normal play too. If it was allowed, it would mean that infantry could sneak up on tanks from about 6" away (with sideways base on the bridging team), which seems really wrong.[/quote]

Good spot, Jonny. Hadn't realised that the leapfrog sneak was a broader issue. It didn't make it any easier to draft the ruling but I think I've cracked it.


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Last edited 07.05.2018 | Top

RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#28 by graham , Thu Jul 05, 2018 7:21 pm

Right then I have modified the doc as promised.

On page 3, I have spelled out the guns in assaults thing a bit better, I hope.
On page 4, I have banned the leapfrog sneak. The wording allows only front ranks of infantry to qualify for the sneak. I think this does the job.
On page 5, I have removed my inadvertent nerf of de Gaulle. (If you don't have de Gaulle in your list, don't worry. If you do, you will understand.)

The doc is at: https://drive.google.com/file/d/14NUXTk4...iew?usp=sharing

Jonny, barring howls of outrage, could you launch a vote on this please?


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RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#29 by ReBrock , Mon Jul 09, 2018 12:50 pm

Hey guys, just wanted to make sure Im interpreting the rule correctly about deploying infantry in ambush with transports. Pag. 95 when you hold a unit in ambush, you may also hold its Transport or infantry attachment in ambush as well, or Deploy them as normal... The case of study is a panzerschutzen platoon held in ambush. The panzerschutzen has sd kfz as transport platoon. Can I hold the infantry in ambush and deploy the sd kfz on the table? What happens when I pop the ambush and the infatry command isnt in command of the sd kfz? Do the sd kfz go off table, or do I have to pop the ambush so that the commanders are in command? Thank you! Or, much better than that, can I/have to pop them mounted in the sd kfzs?

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Last edited 07.09.2018 | Top

RE: v4 Rules Clarifications for ETC

#30 by Rugi , Mon Jul 09, 2018 2:32 pm

1.) Actually, if you put the infantry in ambush together with its attachment (in this case the transport platoon) you have to deploy them mounted!
Same goes for guns.

2.) If you opt to not put them together in the ambush then you cannot deploy them anymore as they cannot get within 6" of the infantry command team. And even if you could deploy them they would be sent to the rear at the end of any movement phase when the transport commander cannot get within 6" of the infantry command team.

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